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  • God Had a Son before Mary Did

    Good morning, Pastor John!

    I had a wonderful time on my trip, thank you all and most importantly, I thank God!

    I have started the book, God had a Son Before Mary Did,*  since returning home.  I believed that message when you revealed it to me, but knowing something and truly knowing it are not the same.  I thought about reading other books since I assumed I already knew the message of this book.  How wrong I was!  And how glad that God put it into my heart to read this one.  And how I love His Spirit guiding me!  

    When I read this and try to take it all in, I can only read a few pages.  Then I must stop and pray to really take it in.  This is a whole new kind of love, to leave heavenly comfort and happiness, knowing the torment of this world He would face, GLADLY to do the will of God.  I pray I can learn to show this kind of love for God, Jesus, and his family, from my heart.  There’s so much I thought I knew.  This deepens my whole way of thinking.  There are precious treasures in here I pray I can take in and live!  I just started reading, but I had to relay my gratitude for the Lord giving you these words to write and your faithful work in doing so. 

    Love,

    Mark

    * Going to Jesus.com – God Had A Son Before Mary Did

  • Today’s Thought for the Evening on Charity

    I absolutely love this TFE on charity, based on 1 Corinthians 13:

    https://goingtojesus.com/gtj_thoughts.html?tname=tfe04-05

    “The love of God does not insist on having its own way; nor does it absolutely have to get its point across, in order to be happy. It is willing that others speak, and is content to be quiet when they want to. It is willing to be last; it is willing to have the smallest piece of the pie; it is willing to stay at home to make room for another to go on a trip; it is willing in all things not to have the pre-eminence because it loves God, and it understands that God dwells with the lowly in heart”

    This kind of love is not human, we cannot improve our fleshly nature to slowly turn into someone who fits this description. We need to die daily, and let Jesus live His life through us, in order for this kind of love (the love of God) to become the very thing that determines the way we think, the way feel, the way we make decisions, the way we live our lives. I love the fact and I’m thankful to God that the Spirit is, indeed, making us into such people, if we are willing. And I love that as we are becoming such people, Jesus gets all the glory for it!

    Zoli

  • Todays Meeting

    John,

    What you preached today was so good!!  It was made so much clearer today to me, how important the law was to God’s people, and how important it was to Him that it was kept the way He gave it to Moses. What an honor to understand such things as He has given us!! Thank you!!

    Stuart

  • “By This” Comment: Gary

    Hi John,

    I love these kinds of studies, when you find a phrase or a topic and you follow the path through… there is always more light on something when you’re done.  The phrase, “by this” seems to have a lot to do with obedience.  Thanks for sharing this.

    I used to sit with my coffee in the morning and work bible things out like this.  One morning in particular, I remember reading the Old Testament prophets like Habakkuk and Hosea, etc., and I saw the similarity among what the Old Testament prophets were condemning, and what the current generation of Christianity’s ministers were preaching.  Something inside rang a bell – and I saw that Christianity’s ministers (and God’s people under them) were so confused. We were doing just what the prophets said NOT to do.  What hope was there?  I cocked my head back, and looked up at the ceiling, and with all my heart I said, “Oh God, there has to be truth out there somewhere.  Jesus, send me truth!”

    A few weeks later I had your tracts in my hand.*  Who knew?!  🙂

    Praise the Lord!

    Gary

    https://goingtojesus.com/gtj_tracts.html

    ================================

    “By This” in 1John

    When reading through John’s first epistle, I was intrigued by a phrase repeatedly used by John.  It was, “by this, we know”, or “by this,” such-and-such is known.  So, I made a list of the twelve times John said we know something “by this”.  Here they are:

    1. Who Knows God?

    1John 2:3. By this, we know that we have come to know him: if we keep his commandments.

    1John 2:4–5. He who says, “I know him,” and does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, but whoever keeps his word, the love of God truly is perfected in him.  By this, we know that we are in him.

    Lesson: Every person who knows God obeys Him.

    =======

    1. Who Loves God and His Children?

    1John 5:2. By this, we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments.

    1John 3:10. By this, the children of God and the children of the Accuser are distinguished: everyone who is not doing righteousness is not of God, as well as the one who does not love his brother.

    Lesson: Every person who loves God and His children obeys Him.

    =======

    1. Who Showed Us What Love Is?

    1John 4:9. By this was the love of God made manifest among us, that God sent His only Son into the world, that we might live through him.

    1John 3:16. By this, we have come to know love, in that he laid down his life for us; and so, we ought to lay down our lives for the brothers.

    Lesson: Jesus showed us what love is by suffering and dying for us.

    Paul explained this when he wrote, “Rarely will someone die for a righteous man, though for a good man, one might possibly bring himself to die, but God commends to us His kind of love, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us” (Rom. 5:7–8).

    =======

    1. How Do We know We Love People as Christ Loved Us?

    1John 3:18–19. My children, let us not love in word or with the tongue, but in deed and in truth.  And by this, we know that we are of the truth, and we will assure our hearts before Him.

    1John 4:16b–17a. God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.  By this, love has been perfected among us.

    Lesson: We love as Christ loves when we put love into practice.

    Jesus told his disciples, “I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, so you also must love one another” (Jn. 13:34–35).  But they could not obey that commandment until the kind of love Jesus was given to them at Pentecost, as Paul said, “The love of God is poured out within our hearts by the holy Spirit which is given to us” (Rom. 5:5).

    =======

    1. How Are We Perfected in the Love of God?

    1John 4:16b–17a. God is love, and he who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.  By this, love has been perfected among us.

    Lesson: We are perfected in God’s love by abiding in it.

    =======

    1. How Do We know that Christ Is Still Living in Us, and We in Him?

    1John 4:12b–13. If we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us.  By this, we know that we abide in Him, and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.

    1John 3:24b. By this, we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit that He gave us.

    Lesson: The Spirit tells us if we are walking in love and if God is living in us.

    Paul told the saints at Philippi that if they were in any way failing to walk in the perfect way of Christ, then God (through the Spirit) would let them know (Phil. 3:15).

    =======

    1. How Do We know That We Have Received the Spirit of God?

    1John 4:2. By this, the Spirit of God is known: every spirit that confesses Jesus Christ when he has come into a person is of God.

    Lesson: The Spirit of God confesses Christ every time he enters into someone’s heart.

    Jesus described this experience to Nicodemus when he said that the Spirit of God would always make a sound when someone receives it (Jn. 3:1–8).  The disciples experienced this on the day of Pentecost, when they received the Spirit and it spoke in tongues through them (Acts 2:1–4).

    =======

    1. How Do We know Who Is of God and Who Is Not?

    1John 4:6. We are of God.  He who knows God listens to us; he who is not of God does not listen to us.  By this, we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

    Lesson: Those who are of God believe and obey what John and the other apostles taught.

    The children of God who have gone astray may still be God’s children, but they are no longer “of God” if they no longer will listen to what the apostles taught.

  • John’s Baptism

    John,

    I feel that a certain part of John the Baptist’s baptism has not been emphasized enough, and in modern times is not even mentioned.  We know that John’s baptism was ordained by God only for the Jews and that it always included a message for the person baptized: “I baptize you in the name of the One who was coming, who will baptize you with the holy Ghost and fire.”  But a crucial element was that the baptizer had to be anointed and sent by God to perform the baptism.  If not anointed, how would the baptizer know a person had repented?  According to how I am thinking, to baptize someone who had not truly repented would not have been John’s baptism, even if the baptized person was a Jew.  It would be just another useless, dead ceremony.

    ==========

    Yes, Wendell.  John’s anointing (and later, the anointing of Jesus’ disciples) to know who had repented was critical to the process.  They never baptized anyone who came to them without truly repenting.  The example of this was Apollos in Acts 18.  He thought he was baptizing with John’s baptism, but he did not have John’s anointing to do so.  Therefore, Apollos’ baptism was worthless.  That is why in Acts 19, Paul re-baptized those twelve Jews whom Apollos had baptized.  They had truly repented, but being Jews, they had to receive the real baptism of John, and Paul was anointed to do that for them.  And when he did that, he laid hands on them and they received the holy Ghost.

    ==========

    Another question is, after the Spirit was made available, if the Jew receiving John’s baptism had repented when they were baptized in water, wouldn’t he receive the Spirit at the same time he was baptized in water?

    Thanks, 

    Wendell

    ==========

    Yes, he would, for receiving John’s baptism was the final thing God required of the Jews.

    Thank you for the good comment and question!

    Pastor John

  • Answers to Johnny’s Mom’s Questions

    Hey!

    I wanted to tell you more about what blessed me during Sunday morning’s discussion, when you were answering Johnny’s mother’s questions.   There were three things that really helped me in that conversation.  

    First, when Barbara was telling her experiences about makeup and jewelry, etc., I felt like some wrong ideas I had about that got washed away.  I’ve known for years that it isn’t sin for women to wear makeup, etc., but somehow in my own conscience, I wouldn’t have felt the liberty to wear it.  I don’t know how that got so ingrained in me.  But hearing Barbara talk about her experiences, I felt like more of that wrong idea got washed away from me.  It was a reinforcing of something I knew, but this time it felt like it settled in more.  We just need to fit in with the decent people around us, and sometimes that might even require us to wear makeup or dress up more for an occasion.  Thank God for that conversation!

    Then, I got a clearer understanding about the scriptures that talk about the cutting of women’s hair – specifically where Paul said, “we have no such custom”.  I guess I have always read that as if Paul was saying that “we have no such custom for a woman to have short hair and no such custom for a man to have long hair.”  But how I understood it Sunday is that Paul was saying we don’t have a custom either way – whether to have short hair or long hair.   We are to just blend in with the decent people in our time/culture, etc.  Did I understand that right?

    And last, about the scriptures in 1Corinthians that talk about speaking in tongues with an interpreter present.  I never understood before that the reason 1Cor. 14:28 is misunderstood is because of the mistranslation of the word church.  Paul wasn’t talking about a building!  He was saying if you speak in the Assembly (to the Assembly) in tongues, to let there be an interpreter.   It’s okay to speak in tongues in the building if you’re speaking to God!

    That was really good to me. I’m so thankful I got to hear all of that!

    Lyn

    =========

    Hi Lyn.

    You are one of several people who later told me that our discussion Sunday morning of the questions Sister Lisa sent helped clarify some things for them.  I am thankful for that.

    As for the custom Paul mentioned concerning the length of one’s hair, the way you have always understood Paul’s comment was right.  Paul was indeed saying that the saints at that time had no custom of short hair for women or long hair for men.  But the larger point was what you next suggested, which is that customs change, and wise children of God change with them.  No style or custom applies to all people at all times in all places.  Only the doctrines of God have unchanging authority over believers at all times and places.

    If anything stands out about us, it is to be the goodness, wisdom, and power of God in Christ Jesus, not our style of dress or hair.

    Again, I am thankful that you and others were blessed by the answers given to Johnny for his dear mother.

    Pastor John

  • Is the Anointing a Ceremony?

    John, Good Morning.

    You answered my question Sunday morning, when reading some scriptures in Acts, but that brings me to my next question: If a person has to be anointed to perform an act, is that a ceremony?  I am thinking not.

    Wendell

    =========

    No, Wendell, the anointing of God is not a ceremony in this covenant, as it was in the old one.  Now, the anointing to do anything in God’s kingdom is in the Spirit, and by the Spirit alone.  In the Old Testament, physical oil was used to anoint someone, but not now.  No rituals exist in God’s kingdom.

    Pastor John

  • Hell Book – New Section

    The new section of the Hell book that we read together in Hebrew class on Tartarus was really sobering and good last night.  I went home and just wanted to get on my face.  Jesus have mercy on me – to think about being in a place where you can’t be forgiven while you’re alive.  

    Good to know that our friend Jesus always walks beside us.  Thankful to have a part with what God is doing & thank you Pastor John for caring for us all these years! red heart

    Rebekah E.

    *Attached is the new section.

    ========

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    Chapter Three 

    Tartarus and the Abyss 

    IS TARTARUS A PLACE OF TORMENT? 

    References to Tartarus anywhere in the ancient world are rare, but one is found in  Homer’s Iliad (8.13), written centuries before Jesus was born. There, Zeus, the Greeks’  supreme god, threatened any of the gods who might dare to disobey his command, “I’ll  catch him and throw him down into Tartarus! A black hole that! A long way down! A  Pit under the earth! Iron gates and brazen threshold! As far below Hades as Heaven is  above the earth!” So, the Greeks believed that Tartarus was a place far beneath the  surface of the earth. 

    The word Tartarus is used but once in the Bible, in verb form, by Peter: “God spared  not the angels who sinned, but tartarized them and consigned them to chains of blackness  to be held until the Day of Judgment” (2Pet. 2:4). In most English translations, 1 including the King James Version, the phrase, “tartarized them” is translated as “cast  them down to Hell”. So, English translators, by and large, have accepted as true the  ancient pagan notion that Tartarus, like Hell, is somewhere below the surface of the earth.  But that is not true. Tartarus is a spiritual condition; it is not a location. 

    It is revealing that Peter and Jude both said that the fallen angels are already “under 2 gloomy darkness” and are already in chains of darkness, being held there until the time  comes for their final judgment. So, fallen angels are not yet in torment, though they are  already in Tartarus. They themselves seem to know that the time for their eternal torment  is yet to come: “When Jesus had come to the other side, to the territory of the Gergesenes,  two demon-possessed men met him, coming out of the tombs, so extremely fierce that no  one could travel along that road. And, behold, they cried aloud, saying, ‘What have we to  do with you, Jesus, Son of God? Have you come here to torment us before the time?’”  (Mt. 8:28–29). Peter’s teaching concerning the tartarization of angels matches that of  Jude: “Angels who did not keep to their own domain, but left their proper abode, God 3 has reserved in eternal chains, under gloomy darkness, until the Judgment of the Great  Day” (Jude 1:6). Nothing is said of them being tormented at the present time. 

    ===== 

     See Appendix, “Tartarus”. 1 

     See Appendix, “Fallen Angels”. 2 

     This is apparently a reference to Genesis 6:1–2. We are told that angels in Heaven do not marry (Mt. 22:30; Mk. 3 12:25), but it appears that some of them left their heavenly bodies (“their proper abode”), came down from Heaven  (“their own domain”), and possessed men so that they could mate with beautiful women (the “strange flesh” they  went after – Jude 1:7). Afterward, it appears that God would not allow them to return into their angelic bodies, but  condemned them to a bodiless existence, unless they could find someone or some animal to possess.

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    So, the answer to our question “Is Tartarus a place of torment?” is no. Tartarus is not  a place at all; it is a horrible spiritual condition. 

    WHO IS TARTARUS FOR? 

    Peter’s mention of tartarized angels is in a chapter that is not about angels at all (2Pet.  2); it is instead devoted to warning God’s children to be faithful, lest God tartarize them!  God’s tartarization of some of His angels is but one illustration among several that Peter  used to demonstrate how severely God deals with treachery in His kingdom. 

    It is significant that Peter said nothing about sinners being tartarized. This is because  only those who have received the Spirit of God and been born anew into God’s family  can be, as Jude put it, “twice dead and uprooted” (Jude 1:12). All who are now in Christ  were once dead in sin (cf. Eph. 2:1, 5; Col. 2:13), but when God tartarizes a believer, that  believer is made dead in sin again, but this time permanently. Solomon warned God’s  people in the Old Testament, “He that, being often reproved, hardens his neck shall  suddenly be destroyed, and that without remedy” (Prov. 29:1). Tartarization, then, is a  curse reserved for self-willed, treacherous servants of God, whether heavenly beings or  men. On earth during the Old Testament, that meant treacherous against the law of  Moses, but in this covenant, it means treacherous against the Son of God, of whom that  law spoke. 

    In their comments on the subject, both Peter and Jude focused on those tartarized  believers who act as leaders among God’s people, but God has also tartarized some who  are not leaders, such as those in Israel, mentioned previously, who mocked God’s call for  repentance (Isa. 22:12–14). Likewise, Jesus warned his followers that whoever dared to 4 blaspheme the holy Spirit would never be forgiven, in this life or the next (Mk. 3:28–29).  Such children of God are damned while they live, cursed to live out the rest of their lives  in sin, with no hope of forgiveness. 

    So, the answer to our question “Who is Tartarus for?” is that it is for treacherous  members of the kingdom of God. 

    ===== 

    IF TARTARUS IS NOT A PLACE, 

    THEN WHERE ARE TARTARIZED BELIEVERS? 

    Peter revealed the answer to this question when he warned the saints that they would  be “among you” (2Pet. 2:1) being “preserved under punishment until the Day of  Judgment” (2Pet. 2:9). Having received the Spirit, they are children of God, but they as  cursed with blindness and continue worshipping with the body of Christ without having  any hope of eternal life (cf. 2Pet. 2:13). 

     That is, whoever among believers. Blasphemous sinners can be forgiven, as was the apostle Paul (1Tim. 1:12–13). 4

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    So, the answer to our question, “Where are tartarized believers?” is that they are  among believers. 

    ===== 

    CAN SOMEONE IN TARTARUS REPENT? 

    No one, of himself, is capable of godly sorrow for sin, for repentance is the work of  God within a heart. Jesus told a group of his fellow Jews, “No one can come to me  unless the Father who sent me draw him” (Jn. 6:44). The earliest believers understood  this, and when the believing Jews in Jerusalem heard that some Gentiles had received the  Spirit, they rejoiced – not because those Gentiles had decided they would repent and  believe the gospel, but because God had “granted repentance to the Gentiles” (Acts  11:18). In Tartarus, however, no soul is ever granted the godly sorrow that produces  repentance. Such is the spiritual condition of Satan, as described by God Himself: “His  heart is hard, like a stone. Yea, it is hard like a lower millstone” (Job 41:24). And it is  God who hardened it so; that is tartarization. 

    God grants no repentance to those in Hell, either, but the great difference between  Hell and Tartarus, and the condition which makes Tartarus far worse is that a tartarized  soul is condemned to stay alive in their sinful condition, without hope of forgiveness  because forgiveness follows repentance, and God will not grant it. Those in Hell cannot  add sin to their record and make their Final Judgment worse, but for souls in Tartarus,  just the opposite is true. They are cursed to continue to live according to their own will  until God allows them to die. As Peter said, they are cursed children of God who can no  longer cease from sin. They are continually making their final judgment worse. For  souls in Tartarus, to be in Hell, where they can do nothing, would be a blessing. 

    Judas the betrayer discerned that he would never be forgiven for what he had done.  He was with Jesus at the Last Supper, perhaps looking into Jesus’ eyes when the Lord  said, “Woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! It were good for him if that  man had not been born” (Mt. 26:24). And later that same night, after betraying Jesus,  rather than continue living out what he knew was now a damned life, Judas killed himself  – and awful as that was, suicide was for him the best option. 

    The beauty and goodness of life on earth is that it is a place of almost boundless hope,  a place of opportunity to do what is good in God’s sight, a place of opportunity for  growth in understanding and righteousness, a place where we may be corrected and  change, a place where choices are still available and responses can still be made to God’s  love. For tartarized believers, however, that no longer holds true. 

    So, the answer to our question “Can someone in Tartarus repent?” is no; God will not  allow it. 

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    DO TARTARIZED PEOPLE KNOW THEY ARE TARTARIZED? 

    Referring to tartarized people, Peter made the following comments: “They are spots  and blemishes . . . reveling in their deceitful ways while they feast with you. . . . For if  after escaping the defilements of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior  Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, their last state is worse than  the first. It would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than  after knowing it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them” (Excerpts,  2Peter 2). 

    Peter’s description of tartarized souls leaves no doubt that tartarized children of God  are blind to their condition and that they feel that they belong among the saints; indeed,  they may even feel qualified to lead them. If they understood their true spiritual  condition, they could not possibly “revel” and “feast” with the saints, as Peter said they  do. They are the “impostors” whom Paul said would come, “deceiving and being  deceived” (2Tim. 3:13). 

    That those in Tartarus do not know they are there is one element which makes  Tartarus the most horrific of all spiritual conditions. The tartarized leaders of Israel  certainly did not realize how wretched their spiritual condition was: “Strangers consume  his strength, but he does not know it; yea, gray hair is showing up on him, but he does not  know it. The pride of Israel shows on his face, but they do not return to the LORD their  God, nor seek Him in all this” (Hos. 7:9–10). Tartarized ministers of this covenant are  like them. 

    Swift Destruction? 

    For years before I understood tartarization, I wondered how Peter could have said that  “swift destruction” would come upon false teachers in the body of Christ and that “their  destruction is not asleep”, inasmuch as he also said that those false teachers would enjoy  successful religious careers. Tartarization was the answer, for that is the “swift  destruction” which comes upon those who stubbornly refuse to obey the truth God has  shown them. It is a destruction that is so complete that they do not even know that they  are destroyed. 

    Concerning tartarized believers who are ministers, Peter gave this warning to the  saints: “There will be false teachers among you, who will introduce opinions that lead  damnation. . . . These, like unreasoning beasts of nature, . . . speak evil of things they do  not understand. . . . They cannot cease from sin, and they seduce unstable souls. They  are cursed children [of God], having forsaken the right way and gone astray in following  the way of Balaam, who loved the reward of unrighteousness . . . . They are wells 5 

     See Appendix, “The Way of Balaam”. 5

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    without water, clouds driven by a storm, for whom is reserved the blackness of eternal 6 darkness. . . . Making pretentious, vain speeches [sermons], they entice to sensuality  through lusts of the flesh those who once had truly escaped from those who live in error.  Promising them liberty, themselves being servants of corruption” (excerpts, 2Peter 2). 

    Tartarized believers are among the third kind of soil in Jesus’ parable of the Four  Kinds of Soil (Mt. 13:3–8, 18–23). According to that parable, the first kind of soil  rejected the truth because of ungodly influences; the second kind of soil turned away  because of persecution; but the third kind of soil failed because of the deceitfulness of  riches and desire for worldly things. Those of this kind of soil do not cease worshipping  with the saints, and they may think they are doing well, but their spiritual growth has  been stopped and they bear no fruit acceptable to God. As Peter said, they continue  “feasting” with the saints, though they are “spots and blemishes” on the fabric of the  congregation’s fellowship. Indeed, they may even become leaders of the congregation,  delivering impressive sermons which attract men’s souls (cf. 2Pet. 2:1, 18–19). And in  the end, when Jesus rejects them, they will be very surprised (cf. Mt. 7:21–23). 

    The misguided confidence of such believers is a most fearsome curse. Under this  curse, some of these consider themselves to be apostles of Jesus (2Cor. 11:13). They  light their own fire, Isaiah said, setting others on fire with their doctrines, who in turn  become little sparks reflective of their leader, and those sparks pass on to others their vain  form of service to God (Isa. 50:11). Under this curse, tartarized leaders of Israel spent  fortunes evangelizing others (Mt. 23:15). Under this curse, God’s own servants are  transformed into ministers of Satan (2Cor. 11:15), with a heart as hard as Satan’s,  proclaiming a gospel that contradicts the truth and persecuting the upright, “thinking they  are offering a service to God” (Jn. 16:2). And because of them, Peter said, “the way of  truth will be spoken evil of ” (2Pet. 2:2). 

    Paul taught that God is just, to turn over to darkness those who have been given the  light of His Son but who then choose not to walk in it. Said Paul, “Because they did not  receive the love of the truth, God will send them a strong delusion,” causing these  formerly loved sons and daughters to “believe the lie, so that they all might be damned  who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in unrighteousness” (2Thess. 2:10–12).  And before he came to earth, Christ prayed for God to likewise blind those in Israel who  would reject him as their Messiah: “Return, O LORD, a recompense upon them according  to the work of their hands. Give them hardness of heart, your curse upon them. In your anger, pursue and destroy them from under the heavens of the LORD!” (Lam. 3:64–66). 

    BLESSED AND USED BY GOD 

    When God blesses tartarized saints, it is only to blind them to their true spiritual  condition and make them bold in their error. Such children of God often often have a  

    6 This is a reference to Proverbs 25:14: “A man who boasts of a false gift is like clouds and wind without rain.”

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    sense that God is using them, and they are correct in that, but they do not realize that God  is using them only to try the hearts of His other children who still have hope. My father  drifted away from God once, yet continued in his ministry. Sinners would be convicted  by his preaching, he told us, and would come fall down and weep for their sins. Then he  added, “They looked up to me as a holy man, but I would have given anything to be as  free in spirit as they were.” Thankfully, he was not tartarized; God allowed him to feel  his need of forgiveness, and he repented and was forgiven. For those who are not granted  repentance, however, Jesus described what their plea will be in the end when they are  condemned: “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter into the kingdom of  heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me in  that day, ‘Lord! Lord! Haven’t we prophesied in your name, and cast out demons in your  name, and performed many miracles in your name?’” (Mt. 7:21–23; cf. Mt. 25:31–46). It  is sobering to consider that even after being tartarized, these cursed children of God were  still able to use their blessings, including spiritual gifts, to minister to others. It is  admittedly difficult to imagine a cursed child of God still healing the sick, prophesying,  rejoicing in the Spirit, etc. But that is our own way of thinking. Jesus said it would  happen with some of God’s children. Too late, though, those children will learn that God  has only been using them, even in their fallen state, for others’ good. 

    We cannot help but see the harshness of this; at the same time, it is true. And it is a  truth which makes every wise soul tremble. God’s judgments against sin can be  extremely harsh. But whatever God decides to do with anyone is perfectly just because  God is perfect and just. 

    A Mixture 

    Although souls in Tartarus still have choices and are free to make changes, no choice  or change they make can please God, regardless of how good those choices appear to  men. Jesus warned his disciples, “That which is highly esteemed among men is an  abomination in the sight of God” (Lk. 16:15), and so it is with tartarized ministers. They  may be highly esteemed by thousands, but they are used by God to minister in spiritual  blindness, leading the blind from the deepest ditch of all. As Peter said it, “promising  [their listeners] liberty, they themselves are servants of corruption” (2Pet. 2:19). 

    God hates wickedness, of course, but He hates a mixture of wickedness and goodness  even more. There was a pastor in Laodicea whose love for God was mixed with love for  the world. Jesus said to him, “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I  would that you were either cold or hot. So, because you are lukewarm, and neither hot  nor cold, I am about to vomit you out of my mouth” (Rev. 3:15–16). “Mixed” is an apt  description of Tartarus, for it is a mixture of blessings with the greatest curse, a mixture  of life and death. They are blessed with life, but cursed with the kind of life they must  live. They are blessed with the ability to change, but they can only change from one 

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    sinful thing to another. They can still grow (they have no choice about that), but they can  only grow more damned – and this, they constantly do. 

    Paul described such believers as abandoned by Christ, being “reprobate concerning  the faith” (2Tim. 3:8; cf. 2Cor. 13:5). Of such apostates, Jeremiah said, “Men will call  them ‘rejected silver’, for the LORD has rejected them” (Jer. 6:30). That is a tragic end to  a life once sanctified by the Spirit of God; yet, heartbreaking as it is, we must confess that  it really happens. To deny that it happens is unwise, and it changes nothing. 

    So, the answer to our question “Do tartarized people know they are tartarized?” is no. ===== 

    CAN WE KNOW WHO HAS BEEN TARTARIZED? 

    God is incomparably merciful and very slow to anger. He has joyfully welcomed  home many a believer who drifted away from righteousness and wanted to come back to  Him. Jesus’ parables of the Prodigal Son (Lk. 15:11–32) and the Ninety and Nine (Mt.  18:12–13) powerfully showed this to be true. James spoke of backslidden believers being  restored in faith: “Brothers, if anyone among you is led astray from the truth and someone  turns him back, let him know that he who turns the sinner from his wandering way will  save a soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins” (Jas. 5:19–20). 

    Jesus said, “There is joy among God’s angels over one sinner who repents” (Lk.  15:10), but that is only because the angels follow God’s lead. If He were not rejoicing  over that repentant soul, the angels certainly would not. Heartfelt repentance is a gift  from God (cf. Acts 11:19), and it makes God happy for one of His beloved, backslidden  children to receive that gift. 

    But how do we know (1) who has fallen away, since many ungodly believers continue  to be religious, and (2) who will God still allow to repent, and who He will not? The  answer is that, as Jesus told his disciples, “With men, it is impossible.” God alone knows  where each soul stands with Him. He does, in many cases, reveal to His servants the true  spiritual condition of someone, but apart from such revelation, it is impossible for us to  discern between a backslidden soul whom He will still allow to repent and a tartarized  soul whom He has rejected. 

    Paul wrote Timothy concerning two men, Hymenaeus and Alexander, who had ruined  their good conscience and “made shipwreck of their faith” (1Tim. 1:19). Moreover, he  said, they had begun teaching a doctrine that was so detrimental to the saints that Paul  had “turned them over to Satan” (1Tim. 1:20). But Paul seemed to have a healing  purpose for doing so! He told Timothy that he had turned Hymenaeus and Alexander  over to Satan, “that they may be taught not to blaspheme.” In other words, those two  foolish believers might still learn to do right. The lesson in Paul’s words is clear: judge  no one, but wait on the judgment of God. God has children who have done some very  wicked deeds; still, no one is hopeless unless God says so.

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    Hymenaeus and Alexander may never have learned their lesson and repented; we are  not told. There are believers who die without heeding God’s call to repent. Paul speaks  of some Corinthian believers who did that (1Cor. 11:29–30). But he then adds that God  judged them with sickness and, in some cases, death so that they would not be  condemned with the world (1Cor. 11:32). So, it is possible to die without repenting of  something with which God is displeased, and yet still have hope.7 

    To die that way is sad, certainly, but a harsh chastisement meant to punish and save is  not nearly as bad as being cursed to live a life that is already damned. For someone who  has done that, John said not to waste your breath by praying for him: “If anyone sees his  brother committing a sin that does not call for death, he shall ask, and He will give him  life for those who commit sins that do not call for death. There is a sin that calls for  death; I do not say that he should pray for that. All unrighteousness is sin, but there is a  sin that does not call for death” (1Jn. 5:16–17). And again, only Jesus knows who has  committed which kind of sin – Jesus and those to whom he chooses to reveal it. 

    So, the answer to the question, “Can we know who has been tartarized?” is no –  unless God chooses to reveal it to us.  

    ===== 

     Examples of this may be Ananias and Sapphira, whom God killed for lying to Peter (Acts 5:1–11). If a premature 7 death was the only punishment for their error, they were blessed, compared to being cursed by God to live on among  His saints in a damned state.

  • Thankful for the Bond in the holy Ghost

    I did not attend the early morning fireplace chat, today, Thursday.  I had some things on my heart that I wanted to get still about, and talk to Jesus.

    I did.  And many of the things I FELT and the prayers that I prayed were echoed by Allison when she returned home, aglow from the out-pouring at this morning’s gathering.  Good to know that I was in the same “PLACE”, although not physically in the same place with you all.  It felt good.

    I was blessed by knowing that I was in one accord with others in the body while not present with them.  At least a few of the same topics were on my heart in my communion with the Lord.  

    Brad

  • “Whosoever Will!”

    Pastor John,

    You have been saying some great things on our Old Testament* cds this week.  You just said that there was a man who said to your father, “Even if I saw my own name written down in the Bible saying I was gonna get the holy Ghost and be saved, I wouldn’t believe it.   I would figure that the Bible was talking about someone else with my name.  But when Jesus said, ‘Whosoever will’ … I know I have to be in that group!” (paraphrased)

    I love it because it’s so true!  Every time I hear “whosoever will”, I get happy!  We don’t have to believe it about ourselves, we just have to believe Jesus! 

    Oh, and last week, you said that the first thing Jesus does with a heart is give it hope, and encourage it!  Amen!  I can testify to that!  That is the first thing Jesus did for me!

    Beth

    Old Testament Course (Pt. 1) – Going to Jesus.com

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