So many good things to think on! I had to read these Old Meeting notes twice and pray they would sink in. So good!
Thanks,
Paul Curtsinger
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So many good things to think on! I had to read these Old Meeting notes twice and pray they would sink in. So good!
Thanks,
Paul Curtsinger
John,
When Jonathan asked the question (below), I don’t think I ever put 2 and 2 together like I did reading this.
And are they all still alive today and all the same demons?
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Yes, and yes.
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It makes sense now that when someone contacts the spirit world to get in touch with great-grandma whoever, that the person contacting the other world can answer questions that only family members know! The spirits or demons that they are listening to have been here from day one.
Steve
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That’s right, Steve. It isn’t the dear, departed grandma that is saying those things; it is a demon claiming to be grandma. Solomon said that the dead do not know anything under the sun. They have no part with this life any longer.
Pastor John
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Evening Pastor John,
With the angels who forsook their heavenly bodies to trade for human bodies, were they the first demons in God’s creation?
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Yes.
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Are demons all former fallen angels?
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Yes.
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Prior to them forsaking their heavenly bodies, were there no demons?
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No, there were none. But remember, (1) angels committed that sin very early in world history and (2) humans had fallen into sin even before the angels did that. Men do not need Satan or his angels in order to sin.
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And are they all still alive today and all the same demons?
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Yes, and yes.
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If so, does this mean that since heaven has been purged by God, when he cast Satan out, that no new demons or evil spirits can be made?
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All things are possible, but if there are others added, or will be others, we are not told about it. At the same time, we must admit that it is certainly possible that along the way in human history, more and more angels could have sinned like that.
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Are evil/bad spirits much different from demons?
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There is no difference. But, again, remember that humans have their own evil/bad spirits apart from the evil spirits of fallen angels.
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Are we all today still dealing with the original fallen angels?
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Yes.
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Much obliged,
Jonathan S.
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Good questions, all, Jonathan. Thank you for asking.
Pastor John
Hi John,
I was listening to the audio Bible book of Luke on the way to work this morning, and when it came to Luke 11:14, when Jesus cast out the dumb spirit, it struck me that there were demons and other unclean spirits while Jesus was here on earth. This would have been before Satan and his angels were cast out of heaven in Revelation 12:9. So my question is, could the evil spirits spoken of before Satan was cast out be angels who “left their proper abode” when they possessed humans (e.g. Genesis 6:2,4), and then were not allowed back into heaven, because they no longer had the bodies that God had given them?
Vince
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Hi Vince.
It appears to be the case that the angels who “left their proper abode” (Jude 1:6) to possess men were not afterward allowed to re-enter their original bodies. However, God definitely still allowed them into heaven (cf. 2Kgs. 22:19-22), until the resurrected Jesus banished Satan and all his angels from heaven forever.
The sinful angels not being allowed to re-enter their original bodies, (which Jude also called “their own domain” — Jude 1:6), is different from not being allowed into heaven.
Hope that is clear.
Pastor John
Pastor John,
This came to me.
Satan is angry, bitter, hateful, a victim, disturbed, agitated, and not-at-peace. So is the world which he rules!
Just as bad kings influenced their subjects during the Old Testament, so does Satan influence his subjects in this world.
God help those who unknowingly continue to be ruled by Satan!
~Allison
Pastor John,
I had some good thoughts from the Spirit this morning, mainly: “Stop reacting to your surroundings. Your relationship is with Jesus, not your surroundings.”
That is life in this new covenant: being in this world, but not of it.
We move when Jesus says move. Our being is in him.
If we respond to our surroundings, which are ever-changing and usually in some kind of turmoil, we will be tossed in every direction. We’ll never know what to do, or how much.
We move when he moves.
It was a good reminder this morning that He is Lord of all of it.
Things are changing in this world, more than I ever thought I would see in my lifetime. But we are called to perfect peace, with our hearts and minds stayed on him.
Jerry
John,
I am so thankful and excited about what you taught us tonight in the introduction to the Job study we are about to read together. In Proverbs 4:7, it says, “Wisdom is the principal thing; get wisdom! And with all your getting, get understanding!”
What you taught us tonight about Satan was clearer to me than what I have learned in the past. As you said, it “cleared out some smoke.” We are getting a better understanding of who God is! And that understanding takes away fear and doubt and confusion about Satan and who he is.
How much better it is to have understanding! It takes away fears, confusion and doubts, and replaces it with trust, confidence and respect in the One who it belongs to: God. Thank you for clearing out some of the smoke tonight. What an honor it is to be able to be taught by someone God has sent, such as you, John!
Thank you.
Stuart
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Good Morning Pastor John!
What a wonderful lesson last night. A whole new perspective on the accuser, Job, his friends and even; probably most importantly, God. Wow! I have to let this sink down to my heart. Thank you!
Mark
Pastor John,
Several months ago, I was hugely blessed by two “thoughts for the day” that I read on one of your websites within two weeks from each other. One was a letter you had received from a brother in which he, among other things, wrote that the holy Ghost is not the third person of a “trinity”, but Christ himself. The other one was titled, ‘The Breath of Our Nostrils’, and it was about how Aaron Nelson and your son Elijah discovered a reference to Jesus’ descent into hell in the book of Lamentations. That verse (Lam. 4:20) was another confirmation from the Scriptures of the truth that the Lord, indeed, “is that Spirit”, as Paul called him. The verse from laminatations calls the Messiah (the anointed one) the “breath of our nostrils” – which is clearly a reference to God’s Spirit. By the time I read these “thoughts”, I had already believed in my heart that the doctrine of the trinity was a lie; but the Spirit used these two pieces of writing in a special way to make this revelation (that the Spirit descending on Jesus at the Jordan River was actually the Son himself “suddenly coming into His temple” – Malachi) more real and more personal to me than it had ever been.
Now, today, about two hours ago, I was reading today’s “Thought for the Evening” (8/5)*, and while doing it, I think I found another clue in the Bible that reveals this very same truth. It brought joy and excitement to my heart, so I wanted to share it. In today’s TFE (The Gods, Part Four) there is a quote from Psalms that goes like this: “By the word of the Lord were the heavens made, and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth” (Ps 33:6).
After reading this quote, I had the following thoughts: From John chapter 1 and Revelation 19 we know that Jesus IS the Word of God, and from a number of NT scriptures it is also clear that God created all things through His Son (except for the Son himself who was created by the Father). But here, in Ps 33:6, the Spirit reveals that the work of creation took place not only “by the word of the Lord”, but also through “the breath” (ruach) of the “mouth” of Jehovah. One of the very few things I know about Hebrew is that ruach (just like pneuma in the Greek) is not only the word for “breath” and “wind”, but also the word for “spirit”. Isn’t it clear then, that if God created all things through His Son, but the Scriptures also tell us that God did His creative work by His Spirit (the breath of His mouth), then the two cannot possibly be two separate persons? Isn’t it wonderful?
One of my favorite discoveries on the subject is how plainly Jesus spoke of this, when in John 14 he promised the disciples to give them “another comforter” that he also calls “the spirit of truth” that “shall be in [them]”; and then, right after saying this he adds, “I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you”. I had read these same verses so many times over the years, but it never occurred to me what is now so clear and obvious, after having learned the truth. Praise God for it!
Zoli
I remember reading about all the people in history who would look for the pool of water that would allow them to remain young and live forever. People spent fortunes and even lost their lives looking for this magical pool! And God tells us where it is in the bible. We can all drink freely if we just follow Him! How wonderful that is to know.
I just wanted to share.
How odd man is. Just follow Jesus. But man wants it to be his way. So they chose death, just to be right when they are not.
Mark W.
Hi Pastor John,
These are the things that I learned from the Job bible study.
~ To belong to God is more valuable than any earthly condition.
~ Faith in God and the joy of the Lord can make you know that loneliness can’t compete with belonging to God. Suffering in this world no matter what form it takes is going to end but joy in Christ is an eternal condition. When this world begins to weigh you down flee to your eternal condition.
~ I learned that patience is not enduring suffering in silence. It’s overcoming suffering by complaining to the one who can do something about it and continuing to do God’s will in the meantime.
~ If you want something from God mean it.
Thank you for your teaching.
I hope you all have a wonderful weekend.
Leika
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Hi Leika!
I am so happy that you were able to watch our meeting from the Philippines! When I think of the technology involved in that, I feel like praising God again “for His wonderful works for the children of men.”
Thank you for letting us know what you received from the beginning of our Book of Job study.
God bless you and yours. Hope to meet you in person one day.
Pastor John
Beth’s email (see post 8/3/2023 One Heart) reminded me of something Jesus did last week and I wanted to share…I was cleaning and ran across an old meeting handout on “Being One”. I kept it out, thinking I would give it to someone. Later that morning, I was going through my CDs to organize my music and ran across the CD on “Being One”. The title caught my attention since I had found those papers, so I sat down and listened to it. As I listened, I felt the Spirit washing over me, and the message went somewhere deeper than before. The message blessed me on so many levels. We are one body, and we have rights and responsibilities to help each other and to keep ourselves clean. To function…testify, admonish one another, etc. And we are one with Jesus, and he cares for his own body! It was so good… I’ve listened to it several times since then and want to soak in every drop. I highly recommend this CD to everyone!
I know this was no coincidence that I found the papers and the CD the same day. I will gladly lend my copy if anyone wants to borrow it.
Lyn